Callings in life can be a funny thing. Take mine, for instance. I'm a firm believer that I am here to speak on three biblical covenant principles—sex, marriage and the Sabbath (not necessarily in that order) and yet, January 9 marks 13 years of not having sex (even though I talk and write about it all of the time), I've never been married before (even though I'm a marriage life coach) and the Seventh-Day Sabbath isn't the popular day of spiritual rest; Sunday is. Whenever folks try and interject some level of cynicism into any or all of these things, I typically share what my name means. Shellie is actually Hebrew (an Israeli told me that about eight years ago); it means "Mine; Belonging to Me". I then talk about what Ezekiel 16:8 (NLT) says—"I made a covenant with you, says the Sovereign Lord, and you became mine." After that, I pretty much follow that up with the phrase "watch the fruit". That basically means, things don't always have to look the way you think they should for them to be the way they're supposed to be (Matthew 12:33).
Since I live in the South (Nashville, to be exact), it's common for the follow-up question to then be, "So, what church do you go to?" 9 times out of 10, people are even further thrown off when I say, "I've been out of church as long as I've been abstinent." Then I pause and say, "That's quite the commercial for church, isn't it?" (For the record, I am not anti-church; it just doesn't serve a real purpose for me in this season of my life. I always try and do things that are purposeful. Habit and purpose are not synonyms.) While some go on to tell me how borderline blasphemous I'm being, more times that not, the next question is, "Oh, so you're spiritual instead of being religious?" What I then say might surprise a few of you—"Actually, I try to be more biblical than anything which means I'm a little bit of both."
To me, I think that religious and spiritual are thrown around so much that they could stand to be unpacked more before we casually profess to be either one. If you're curious to know what I mean by that, I've got a few thoughts below.
What It Means to Be “Religious”
Be honest. When you think of the word "religious", what immediately comes to mind? If it's church or even "being churchy", you are certainly not alone.
With studies like "Most Teenagers Drop Out of Church as Young Adults" and "U.S. Church Membership Down Sharply in Past Two Decades" coming out more and more, clearly a lot of people feel the same way. When it comes to what the actual definition of religion is, a pretty basic one would be "a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects". Based on this definition, while there appear to be 12 major religions— Baha'i, Buddhism, Christianity, Confucianism, Hinduism, Islam, Jainism, Judaism, Shinto, Sikhism, Taoism, and Zoroastrianism—the most practiced one, especially within the United States, continues to be Christianity (with Islam and Atheism placing second and third).
Keeping all of this in mind, I would think that when most people say, "I'm not religious", what they mean is they've applied the Walt Whitman quote that I shared up top; that there is something—or a set of things—within a specific faith that insults their soul to the point where they can't full-on say that they are a Christian, Muslim, Jew, Buddhist, etc. That's it's not just about not attending a certain place of worship every week; it's that there are certain principles that they can't honestly say that they agree with either. Hmph. Let me tell it, that's why there are over 200 different denominations within Christianity alone. Although all Christians profess that they believe that Christ is the Son of God, many can't get on the same page beyond that point. And so, there are religions within their own religion. For some, that is not only confusing but draining. So…they bail. Not Christ but the denominations (and yes, there is a difference).
Then there are what my mother refers to as "the walking wounded"; people who don't consider themselves to be religious, not so much because they disagree with a certain a set of principles so much as the people who teach them or sit in the pews and listen to them. Actor Meagan Good (who is married to movie executive and minster DeVon Franklin) comes to mind. Last year, we ran a piece where Meagan said this:
"If I'm being completely honest, my experience with some church folks has not been that positive. It's unfortunate because we're supposed to be the biggest lovers. And it's like even if you disagree with someone or you don't think what they're doing is right, you're supposed to mind your own business and pray for that person. Other times, you're supposed to correct in love if that's what God told you to do. And there was no correction in love. It was like a complete assault."
She's right. While there is a Scripture in the Bible that encourages us to "exhort daily" (Hebrews 3:13), we're also instructed to "speak truth in love" (Ephesians 4:15). Not either or. Both. But that's kind of my point. When I took the time to "Walt Whitman" my own journey, one book that was a game-changer wasPagan Christianity?: Exploring the Roots of Our Church Practices (Frank Viola, George Barna). As I paid closer attention to what I had been taught while growing up vs. what the Bible actually says and what I actually felt at peace within my spirit about, I could no longer say that I was a part of the religion that I was born into. Why? Because I could no longer get down with all of the "beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects".
Peep how it says that people create religions…people do and people are flawed. For instance, Christ did once tell a group of people that if they are without sin, that they should cast the first stone. In that same story, he also told the woman the folks were ridiculing to go and sin no more. Not either or transpired. Both. (John 8:1-12) Unfortunately, a lot of times religion involves people picking and choosing what to preach, teach and model. That's what happens when flawed folks create principles.
Still, that doesn't mean that I'm personally not religious, though. Why do I say that? Because of what I said at the very beginning of all of this. What I do rock with is the Bible (which is an eastern not western culture book; don't let these Americanized religions fool you); it has a very clear definition of religion—"Pure and genuine religion in the sight of God the Father means caring for orphans and widows in their distress and refusing to let the world corrupt you." (James 1:27—NLT) Caring for those without parents or who have lost their beloved? Trying not to let this crazy world jack me up? If that is being religious, oh, I strive to be very religious.
This view of being religious doesn't only apply to Bible followers (who aren't only Christians, by the way). This applies to people who honor other holy books too. If the faith you are most comfortable with has its own definition of religion, don't allow "people's principles" to keep you from applying it to your life; especially since another definition of religious is "a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs".
If you've got a set of core beliefs that are centered around a Higher Being and it helps you to be a (more) moral individual, by definition, you are religious. You just don't subscribe to man-made religion. See the difference there?
My overall point is this. "Religious" isn't a bad word. Succumbing to the pressure to practice what man expects of you over what your spirit says is best for you is the issue and challenge. Which one are you currently doing?
What It Means to Be “Spiritual”
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Spiritual. OK, so whenever someone tells me that they aren't religious but they are spiritual, I tend to ask them to clarify where they are coming from. While I personally do believe that a Satan exists, I know that many don't. At the same time, I think the majority feels that there are forces of light and forces of darkness all around us. Scripture puts it this way—"For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places." (Ephesians 6:12—NKJV) Spiritual hosts of wickedness. Spiritual and wicked. Did you notice that?
Just recently, I listened to a really great podcast featuring Andre 3000 and Rick Rubin. As I was listening to Andre 3000 candidly share his feelings on isolation and loneliness, you can't convince me that he hasn't been battling with some dark spirits. Actor Mack Wilds recently spoke of how grateful he was to have a child on the way after being in "a really dark place"; to me, that's another example of dealing with some "dark spirits". I know a lot of other words and terms were deemed the most popular in 2019, but I personally think that "social anxiety" tops just about all of them. Some "darkness" comes with feeling too paralyzed to create or perform.
So yeah, it should go—and stay—on record that "spiritual" isn't automatically synonymous with good, light or beneficial. Any DC or Marvel comic will show you that.
That's why I encourage folks to break down what they mean when they say, "I'm spiritual". Are you saying that you don't subscribe to a specific religion? Are you saying that you acknowledge that you are a spiritual being? Are you specifying that while you don't go to a place of worship or use a title (like Christian, Muslim, Jewish, etc.) that you're intentional about nurturing your spirit or soul? Just being spiritual isn't good enough. Evil is spiritual.
When I acknowledge that a part of me is spiritual, I think more in line with a quote that is usually attributed to the late author C.S. Lewis—"You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body." The Hebrew word for soul is "nephesh". It's a dope and multi-layered word. It means "a soul, living being, life, self, person, desire, passion, appetite, emotion". Oh, the irony. Peep how when you are nurturing your soul, you are tapping into some of the very things that many religions try and get you to ignore like your desires and your passions. Do these things need a moral compass and some self-control? 100 percent. But, at the same time, if you're not pouring into them as well, you are abandoning the very core of what you are—A SOUL. When John 4:24 tells us that "God is Spirit", and I think of a definition of spiritual being, "of or relating to the spirit or soul, as distinguished from the physical nature", it's a reminder that being spiritual is a good thing—so long as your spirit is ever surrendered to a Higher Being.
So yes, on some levels, I do think there is a difference between being religious and being spiritual. Yet more than that, I wholeheartedly also believe that the two things can co-exist, in harmony. How? It's when man is pulled out and the Source of Love is put in.
In other words, if being religious is about applying a moral code based on a supernatural source of Light and being spiritual is about tapping into that same source in order to fulfill one's desires and passions—it shouldn't be assumed that just because you don't conform to a certain set of practices that you're not religious or that being spiritual means that you're not disciplined or even that you don't apply a holy book to your life. It simply means that you've moved man out of the way so that you can learn more about the Spirit.
And that? That is something to be really at peace, confident and happy about. So, if that's where you are, sis, be that. It's a good and purposeful thing. The truly religious and spiritual individuals will totally agree.
Want more stories like this? Sign up for our newsletter here and check out the related reads below:
I Grew Closer To God After I Left The Church
These 8 Scriptures Are Spiritual Game-Changers For Single Women
5 Signs You're Experiencing A Spiritual Awakening
How To Ground Yourself Spiritually
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In a xoNecoleexclusive, the iconic actress opens up about embracing this season of her life, new projects, and overall being a “bad motherfucker.” Gabrielle reveals that she was 37 years old when she was diagnosed with perimenopause and is still going through it at 51 years old. Mayo Clinic says perimenopause “refers to the time during which your body makes the natural transition to menopause, marking the end of the reproductive years.”
“I haven't crossed over the next phase just yet, but I think part of it is when you hear any form of menopause, you automatically think of your mother or grandmother. It feels like an old-person thing, but for me, I was 37 and like not understanding what that really meant for me. And I don't think we focus so much on the word menopause without understanding that perimenopause is just the time before menopause,” she tells us.
Gabrielle Union
Photo by Brian Thomas
"But you can experience a lot of the same things during that period that people talk about, that they experienced during menopause. So you could get a hot flash, you could get the weight gain, the hair loss, depression, anxiety, like all of it, mental health challenges, all of that can come, you know, at any stage of the menopausal journey and like for me, I've been in perimenopause like 13, 14 years. When you know, most doctors are like, ‘Oh, but it's usually about ten years, and I'm like, ‘Uhh, I’m still going (laughs).’”
Conversations about perimenopause, fibroids, and all the things that are associated with women’s bodies have often been considered taboo and thus not discussed publicly. However, times are changing, and thanks to the Gabrielle’s and the Tia Mowry’s, more women are having an authentic discourse about women’s health. These open discussions lead to the creation of more safe spaces and support for one another.
“I want to be in community with folks. I don't ever want to feel like I'm on an island about anything. So, if I can help create community where we are lacking, I want to be a part of that,” she says. “So, it's like there's no harm in talking about it. You know what I mean? Like, I was a bad motherfucker before perimenopause. I’m a bad motherfucker now, and I'll be a bad motherfucker after menopause. Know what I’m saying? None of that has to change. How I’m a bad motherfucker, I welcome that part of the change. I'm just getting better and stronger and more intelligent, more wise, more patient, more compassionate, more empathetic. All of that is very, very welcomed, and none of it should be scary.”
The Being Mary Jane star hasn’t been shy about her stance on therapy. If you don’t know, here’s a hint: she’s all for it, and she encourages others to try it as well. She likens therapy to dating by suggesting that you keep looking for the right therapist to match your needs. Two other essential keys to her growth are radical transparency and radical acceptance (though she admits she is still working on the latter).
"I was a bad motherfucker before perimenopause. I’m a bad motherfucker now, and I'll be a bad motherfucker after menopause. Know what I’m saying? None of that has to change. How I’m a bad motherfucker, I welcome that part of the change."
Gabrielle Union and Kaavia Union-Wade
Photo by Monica Schipper/Getty Images
“I hope that a.) you recognize that you're not alone. Seek out help and know that it's okay to be honest about what the hell is happening in your life. That's the only way that you know you can get help, and that's also the only other way that people know that you are in need if there's something going on,” she says, “because we have all these big, very wild, high expectations of people, but if they don't know what they're actually dealing with, they're always going to be failing, and you will always be disappointed. So how about just tell the truth, be transparent, and let people know where you are. So they can be of service, they can be compassionate.”
Gabrielle’s transparency is what makes her so relatable, and has so many people root for her. Whether through her TV and film projects, her memoirs, or her social media, the actress has a knack for making you feel like she’s your homegirl. Scrolling through her Instagram, you see the special moments with her family, exciting new business ventures, and jaw-dropping fashion moments. Throughout her life and career, we’ve seen her evolve in a multitude of ways. From producing films to starting a haircare line to marriage and motherhood, her journey is a story of courage and triumph. And right now, in this season, she’s asking, “What’s next?”
“This is a season of discovery and change. In a billion ways,” says the NAACP Image Award winner. “The notion of like, ‘Oh, so and so changed. They got brand new.’ I want you to be brand new. I want me to be brand new. I want us to be always constantly growing, evolving. Having more clarity, moving with different purpose, like, and all of that is for me very, very welcomed."
"I want you to be brand new. I want me to be brand new. I want us to be always constantly growing, evolving. Having more clarity, moving with different purpose, like, and all of that is for me very, very welcomed."
She continues, “So I'm just trying to figure out what's next. You know what I mean? I'm jumping into what's next. I'm excited going into what's next and new. I'm just sort of embracing all of what life has to offer.”
Look out for Gabrielle in the upcoming indie film Riff Raff, which is a crime comedy starring her and Jennifer Coolidge, and she will also produce The Idea of You, which stars Anne Hathaway.
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From a young age, she knew her dreams were too big for the Emerald City so after a quick trip to southern California it was only a matter of time before she called it home. “I’ve always wanted to leave Seattle. There wasn’t enough culture for me, and having grown up there, I knew every Black person, whether it was from school or church,” says Robinson. Immediately after obtaining her Bachelor's degree from the University of Washington, it was then she decided it was time to make her move. “I exhausted all the options, opportunities, and resources I thought I could get from living there and knew I had to leave eventually.”
After graduating from her Alma Mater as a first-generation college student, she chose to continue her education, completing her master's degree at USC. After entering the corporate world, she noticed a lack of information sharing within the Black community, which led to a strong desire to gather community peers, leaders, and experts through sit-down panel discussions. “In corporate spaces, white people are talking and sharing ideas with each other behind closed doors, and I felt Black people didn't have that same network, so I created that space where I saw the gap.”
“In corporate spaces, white people are talking and sharing ideas with each other behind closed doors, and I felt Black people didn't have that same network, so I created that space where I saw the gap.”
Receiving a little motivation from a friend, Conversations with Chanise was created in 2018 with the goal of hosting professional events people could resonate with. “A lot of the time, industry panels can feel dry and disconnected from our culture and community, so I wanted to build that network myself, using it as a platform for others to find knowledge, information, and resources needed to navigate corporate spaces, tools that I didn’t have.”
Continuing to climb in her career, in 2020, Chanise landed a role as a recruiter for one of the fastest-growing tech companies in the world, Snapchat Inc. During her time at the company, she held multiple roles from Recruiter, Diversity, Equality, and Inclusion manager, to eventually landing on the Venture Capital Team, a position that was given because of her impressive community efforts outside of work.
During this time, Conversations with Chanise evolved into Out Of Office due to the COVID-19 pandemic. “In 2020, I changed the name because we were working remotely. Working from home for two years, if you weren't fortunate enough to work for your company prior to the pandemic, then you didn't know your co-workers, especially other Black co-workers.” With the pandemic creating an even bigger challenge to the lack of networking amongst diverse employees, what began as events became a community for Black and Latinx employees from across a number of tech companies to come together and meet fellow peers from across the industry.
It wasn't until 2022 that OOO hosted its first brunch for Black History Month. The invite-only event hosted sixty-five people tech employees, complete with a five-course meal. “Eight people from Amazon attended the event, and that was the first time they had ever met each other, they were all Black.”
Earlier this year, there was an inclination of a soon-to-come recession, which hit the tech world head-on, causing many Americans to be affected. In May of 2022, Chanise was laid off from Snapchat after three and a half years. “I didn’t take the layoff personally. You would think that after being at a company for three years, you would be sad, but since my entire team got laid off, including the people that brought me on, it was just business.”
With a few inside connections, her unemployment was short-lived after receiving two job offers within the following weeks of her being let go. “A former manager on the recruiting team is now the Director of Talent and Acquisition at DoorDash. She reached out about the Senior Program Manager role and encouraged me to apply. All you need is a referral.” She describes this carefree moment of her life as funemployment. “I had another offer from a VC firm, I was on funemployment. I blew my severance check going to Miami buying tables at popular nightclubs, I was having a great time.”
"I didn’t take the layoff personally. You would think that after being at a company for three years, you would be sad, but since my entire team got laid off, including the people that brought me on, it was just business."
With two offers on the table, she went with DoorDash in late September of 2023 as a Senior Program Manager. She was indeed feeling like that girl. Less than 30 days into her new role, she woke up to an unexpected text that sent waves of uncertainty and doubt. Three weeks and two days after starting her new role, Chanise was included in a company-wide layoff.
“A former co-worker from Snapchat was also working at DoorDash at the time and called me at 6:00 a.m. informing me she was included in a company-wide layoff. At that moment, I just knew I couldn’t have been laid off, I just got here,” Chanise recounts. Quickly opening her emails, she saw the dreaded subject line 'Your Employment at DoorDash.' “This time, I was pissed. I was upset and in shock.”
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“The first day I was still in positive spirits, it wasn't until the next day I woke up and realized this was real, and I was scared.” With the economic uncertainty looming, there was a mix of emotions. “A lot of times we talk about recessions, and we know what happened in 2008, but I was a kid in high school. Now I’m an adult, and I’ve been laid off twice. I know it’s not the skillset, and I know it's not my work ethic, so now I’m scared.” The most obvious question she had on her mind was, “What am I going to do?”
Being in such a vulnerable space of fear and uncertainty can bring back traumas buried within our deepest childhood memories. “Not only am I only a first-generation college graduate, but I grew up in a single-parent household,” Chanise details. “My mom's ex-husband had a drug problem, and by the time I was nine years old, my mom filed for bankruptcy, leading to my family and I living in a homeless shelter for a year.”
After being laid off, the possibility of being homeless was a looming fear, but it was only because of past trauma. “My work ethic and drive comes from never wanting to put myself in a position that I was in as a child. When you’re a kid, you don't have control over what happens to you, but I made a pact with God that I would always do whatever it took moving forward, and I would never be disqualified on paper.”
"My work ethic and drive comes from never wanting to put myself in a position that I was in as a child... I made a pact with God that I would always do whatever it took moving forward, and I would never be disqualified on paper."
With what seemed to be back-to-back failures, there were many conversations with God that led her to realize life happens fast and it’s up to us how we deal with it. “I’m in a situation where I can't blame anyone for what I’m going through, I can't say it's anyone else's fault, it just happens to be life.” As scary as it was to be without a job once again, this was a wake-up call for the steadfast entrepreneur. “It’s taught me a lot about the recession. It's understanding that it has nothing to do with me personally. It gave me fuel to never work for just one company at a time. You should always have multiple streams of income, and most of those streams should be things you can control at all times.”
Chanise began to realize that maybe this was the time to take her dreams for Out Of Office to the next level. “OOO was always something that I wanted to do full time, but I don’t think I would have pushed myself to be as full-time as quickly. The summit would have never been something I envisioned for myself to happen this year if I wasn’t laid off.”
Not one to back down from an opportunity, Chanise began to use what she had curated so well within her time in Los Angeles, her community. “I was listening to Kirk Franklin on The Breakfast Club podcast, and his message was to win wounded. When you're trying to cross the finish line in a race, sometimes people get hurt and want to give up, but even if you’re limping, you still need to cross the finish line.”
Wounded, she was still on a mission to fulfill the desires of her heart regardless of her situation. “Before I was laid off from DoorDash, there was a woman on the Diversity and Inclusion team who reached out, informing me they would like me to run their Black employee resource group because of my experience and what I was doing with my Out Of Office events.” She continues, “We had a meeting set for Friday and I was laid off Wednesday, two days before the meeting. Reaching out via LinkedIn, [I] informed her that my role had been eliminated; however, I would like to schedule a call to talk about OOO and what we can do.”
“During the meeting, I spoke with her about my vision to do a cross-company employee resource group summit, and it just so happened the company had plans for one the following year for internal employees. They loved that my vision was much bigger, so they decided to give me the money and let me run it instead.” And just like that, a full circle moment. The company that laid her off after three weeks of employment was giving her $45,000 to become the first official sponsor of her biggest corporate summit to date.
This was the momentum she needed to propel her into her destiny. “Even though I was sad, faith without work is dead,” says Chanise. “A lot of times, people let life stop them from pursuing their dreams, and they just give up, and you never know what it could have been.”
"Faith without work is dead. A lot of times, people let life stop them from pursuing their dreams, and they just give up, and you never know what it could have been."
Once the idea of the Employee Research Summit was to become a reality, there was a lot more work to be done. While planning for the ERG Summit, OOO was to host an upcoming event, and while excited about what was in the works, Chanise states, “I remember telling God I really don’t want to do this. This was the first time I charged people to come to a happy hour, and that’s not normally something I would do. I didn’t know if it was worth it and wanted to cancel, but I didn't.”
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After the event, she was approached by someone from Amazon’s Cross-Functional Strategic Marketing Team, who had consistently attended a number of OOO events. After a brief conversation, Chanise was informed of a sponsorship for professional development opportunities leading Amazon to become the second official sponsor, providing funds and a space to host her upcoming ERG summit. “At that moment, I knew God was telling me to 'keep going and I will provide all the resources.'”
"At that moment, I knew God was telling me to 'keep going and I will provide all the resources.'"
Fortunate to have really great friends, “I was in search of a keynote speaker, I reached out to Trell Thomas, founder of Black Excellence Brunch, who has a great relationship with Ms. Tina Knowles, among many other celebrity influencers. After discussing ideas and budget, he asked me who I’d like to speak at the event, and thinking it was a reach, I requested Ms. Tina.”
To Chanise’s surprise, Ms. Tina confirmed within a week. “She poured so much life into the audience with her message of not giving up or quitting no matter your age. Speaking to her felt like Sunday dinner, my spirit was full.” After a day full of corporate connections and panel discussions, as an added bonus, the summit wrapped up with an after-party performance by Eric Bellinger.
The Out Of Office ERG Summit was not just a moment to bridge the gap between culture and corporations but it was a culmination of hard work, faith, and determination. No matter what door closes, never be afraid of chasing your dreams. “Throughout this journey, I continued to pray. Lord, please send the resources and opportunities. Give me favor with people and help me do the work in which you have given me,” says Chanise. In the end, official sponsors for the summit included Amazon, Doordash, Snapchat, Google, YouTube, Jack Daniels, FIJI Water, and Bumble for Friends.
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As far as going back to work full-time, Chanise shares, “I’ll pray and apply for jobs, but I'll keep working as an entrepreneur. My level of faith has been elevated. What started out as doubt turned into crazy faith.”
On words of encouragement, Chanise advises, “Just keep going, even when you're sad or don’t believe in yourself. Find one person to talk to that you know is going to push and elevate you, an accountability partner. Even if you don’t believe in God, find a faith partner. Find someone who believes and has the faith that you don't, to speak it over you, carrying the faith for you when you can’t.”
This year, Chanise learned that what God has for her is for her, and she’s the only person who can stand in her way. “I’m in my own way sometimes. There's also a difference between providing and sustaining. God will provide you with just enough, and He’ll give you the wisdom and the resources to stretch it long enough for it to last. That's different from asking God to provide.
"We underestimate our creativity. God never gives you a finished project but He gives you the creativity, ideas, and resources to be able to build, sustain, and provide for you. It’s being able to tap into that.”
For more of Chanise, follow her on Instagram @conversationswithchanise.
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