
Jazmine Sullivan & Issa Rae Link Up For An Epic Conversation On Flexing Their Grown Woman Ish

Jazmine Sullivan is music royalty. She's rightfully deemed as one of the best voices to ever hit a studio, and she's also the queen of relatable music, a page out of Mary J. Blige's book. In fact, also similar to Mary, she makes some of the best music when she's her mental health is out of alignment. Ain't that a bitch?
At the top of this year, Sullivan released her highly, highly anticipated EP, Heaux Tales, and even put into the universe a potential collaboration with fellow GOAT, Issa Rae. "What I would love is if me and @IssaRae did a heauxtales short film, and I'd add a few extra songs. But I could just be dreaming. Nvm me. I'm crazy." Issa soon after answered, with five simple words: "Jazmine. Say the f–k less."
Jazmine. Say the fuck less. https://t.co/HRUwr6ZiJK
— Issa Rae (@IssaRae) January 9, 2021
The rest, is Black women's history, as they sneaky linked up for an interview with ESSENCE, hopefully with more to come.
And listen, during this interview, they discussed it all. From being fans of the other, to learning to say 'no more' to the childish things (for now), as our good sis Jazmine says she is now all about therapy, new music, and creating spaces for Black women.
Continue reading for highlights of the cover story below!
On having a master plan...or not:
When Issa asked the crooner how her album Fearless came about, sis responded gracefully:
"I wish I could say I had a master plan, but I really didn't. I was just doing what felt natural, and luckily I had gotten with a record company and with people who allowed me to do that. But for me, I just wanted to express myself in the most natural way, and that means me writing my stories. So many of the songs at that time came from a lot of the childish stuff I was going through.
"For example, busting windows out of an ex's car and literally going straight from doing it to not being able to sleep. I was restless, because I was still in the moment. And so I just started writing about it. I let my girlfriends hear it, and they were like, 'Girl, do your thing—whatever this leads to.' And it led to my world opening up in such a different way…"
On telling Black women's stories:
"Before now, I had really just been concerned about expressing myself and getting my story out there—and people have connected to that. But for this project, it was important for me to share the stories of the women I love and hold dear to my heart. I feel like they are just as banging and dynamic as me. And I want to give space and opportunity to women, period…"
On making space for Black women:
Earlier this year, Jazmine went viral for hitting social media and teaching us all how to perfect the art of the vocal--a skill she is notorious for. As it turns out, she's just looking out for the culture.
"I feel like we get caught up in thinking there's 'only one' of us. There can only be one R&B superstar; there can only be one rap girl at a time. That's not true. God was not stingy when He was giving out gifts. And you're not the only person. There are many other women, especially Black women, who can do what you do. And let's all create spaces for each other to get out there and do that…"
On self-care and finding the right therapist:
"The first five minutes I was holding back tears, because I was like, 'Wow, this is the first time I'm actually speaking about my feelings. And it's not in a song. It doesn't require notes. I don't need to impress anybody with what it is that I'm actually doing. This is the first time.' So I was holding back tears even doing that. But after that first five minutes, I was surprised by how much I was enjoying speaking to somebody, and somebody listening to me, and I didn't have to perform to do it.
"But finding the right therapist is a process—because I went to therapy one time, years ago, and I hated the experience, and I feel like it stopped me from going for a long time. And then I found this new lady, and it's a totally different experience. So you have to find the right person for you, that you actually want to open up to. But once you do that, a weight lifts off of you—just from speaking, just from telling your story. And that's what Heaux Tales was. It's like, 'Tell it, girl. Tell it. Set yourself free.'"
So here for all of this, whew!
Sullivan is headlining this year's ESSENCE Festival of Culture presented by Coca-Cola®. The full conversation between Jazmine Sullivan and Issa Rae for the July/August 2021 issue of ESSENCE, will be available on newsstands + digital platforms June 29.
Featured image via Paras Griffin/Getty Images for Tyler Perry Studios
Charmin Michelle is a southern native and creative spirit who works as a content marketer and events manager in Chicago. She enjoys traveling, #SummertimeChi, and the journey of mastering womanhood. Connect with her on Instagram @charminmichelle.
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'Black Girl Magic' Poet Mahogany L. Browne Talks Banned Books And The Power Of The Creative Pivot
You know you’re dealing with a truly talented and profound voice of a generation when the powers that be attempt to silence it. As a poet, educator, and cultural curator, Mahogany L. Browne has carved out a powerful space in the world of literature and beyond.
From penning the viral poem, “Black Girl Magic,” to writing Woke: A Young Poet’s Call To Justice (a book once banned from a Boston school library), to becoming the 2024 Paterson Poetry Prize winner and a poet-in-residence at Lincoln Center—her path exemplifies resilience, reinvention, and unapologetic artistry. She's published more than 40 works and paid the bills with her craft, a divine dream for many creatives seeking release, autonomy, and freedom in a tough economic climate.
A Goddard College graduate, who earned an MFA from Pratt Institute and was awarded an honorary doctorate from Marymount Manhattan College, Mahogany offers unapologetic realness with a side of grace and empowerment. "I started touring locally. I started creating chat books so that those poems will go in the hands of the people who were sitting in the rooms," she shared.
"And then I started facilitating poetry workshops, so I used my chat books as curriculum. And that, in turn, allowed me to further invest in my art and show the community and people who were hiring me that it wasn't just a one-off, that it's not just, you know, a fly by night—that I am invested in this art as much as I am invested in your community, in your children's learning, in our growth."
Mahogany has a special way of moving audiences, and her superpower sparks shifts in perspective, post-performance introspection, and strengthening of community bonds, especially among Black women. (One can undeniably recognize her gift for arousal of the spirit and mind merely from her listening to her insights from the other side of a Google Hangout call. I can only imagine the soul-stirring, top-tier sensory encounter when watching her perform in person.)
In this chat with xoNecole, Mahogany reflects on sustaining a creative career, the aftermath of writing a banned book, and using poetry for both healing, community-building, and activism.
Anthony Artis
xoNecole: What are three key things that have laid the foundation for a sustainable creative career for you?
Mahogany L Browne: What has helped me is that I'm willing to go in being an expert at knowing poetry and knowing the way in which art can change the landscape of our lives, not just as a poet, but also as a poetry facilitator. How you move through classes, those things are mastered, right? So when I go into another space that's maybe tech-heavy, I don't mind learning and being, you know, a student of the wonder of how we can make this magic, work together.
Two, you’ve got to know how to pivot. Sometimes we say, ‘Alright, this is what my life is going to be. I'm going to be a New York Times best-selling author. I'm going to, you know, have an album that's Grammy-nominated. And then, say you get dropped from your record label. That doesn't mean you can't make an album anymore. You can also still create an album that can be submitted to the Grammys. So, what does a pivot look like as an artist who doesn't have an institution behind them? Pivot being a student of the wonder.
Relationships also really help. How do I serve the community? And in turn, that tells me how the community can show up. For me, I have long-standing ties with a community that will outlast my one life. So, what does it mean to create space where these relationships can develop, can be nurtured, can be rooted, can be cultivated? Creating space—it happens through relationships.
xoN: With today’s economic challenges, what does your current creative process look like, and what are you working on?
MB: I’m always thinking five years ahead. I just reviewed the pages for two children’s books and recently released a YA novel. I’m drafting an adult fiction manuscript now.
Anything I create is founded with the root of poetry, but it can exist in captions. It can exist in commercials. It can exist as a musical. So that's where I’m at now.
xoN: You started performing "Black Girl Magic" in 2013, had an acclaimed performance of it via PBS and the work went on to viral success shortly after. Talk more about the inspiration. And what do you think about the continued relevance more than a decade later?
MB: I wrote it as a rally cry for the mothers who had been keeping themselves truly in harm's way by, you know, being a part of the community right after the death of their child or their loved one. They are usually mothers of victims of police brutality—and just seeing how they showed up in these community spaces, they are devout to the cause but obviously still grieving.
"I wanted this poem to be just a space of reclamation, of joy and of you, of your light, of your shine, of your brilliance, in any which way in which you fashion. Every room you enter is the room you deserve to be in. What does it mean to have a poem like that that exists?"
And the first time I did the poem, the Weeping that occurred, right? It was like this blood-letting of sorts. The next time I performed it, I'm moved to tears because I'm seeing how it's affecting other women who have just been waiting to hear, ‘You belong. You deserve. You are good. We see you. Thank you, despite everything that they said to make you regret being born in this beautiful brown, dark-skinned, light-skinned, but Black body.’
Black women are the backbone—period. Point blank. And so, that that poem became a necessity, not just to the fortitude of Black women in the community, but like you know, in service of healing the Black women.
xoN: One of your books was banned at a school in Boston, and it was later reinstated due to parental and activist support. What was that experience like?
MB: Well, I think it happened because they were racist. That's it. Point blank. The reversal of it was empowering, right? I realized, oh, I thought we just had to sit here and be on a banned book list. But no, parents are actually the leaders of this charge.
So to see that, the parents said, ‘Nah, we're not gonna let you take this book out of my baby’s school just because it's a Black kid on the front saying, ‘Woke’ and they're talking about being a global citizen. They're talking about accountability. They're talking about accessibility. They're talking about allyship, and you don't want them to have compassion or empathy or have even an understanding, right? So no, we rebuke that, and we want this book here anyway.’ To see that happen in that way. I was, like, reaffirmed. Absolutely.
xoN: You recently organized the Black Girl Magic Ball at the Lincoln Center in New York. Honorees included author and entrepreneur Rachel Cargle and National Black Theater CEO Sade Lythcott. What impact did it have and what expanded legacy do you hope to leave with your creative works?
MB: I was really interested in not celebrating just the book, but celebrating the community that made the book possible. And so I gave out five awards to women doing that thing, like, what does it mean to be a Black girl in this world?
I just thought it was gonna be an amazing time. Everybody's gonna dress up—we're gonna celebrate each other. And boom, I then realized that it responded to like a gaping hole. There was a missing thing for Black girls of all walks of life, all ages, right?
"It's very intergenerational. That was intentional to come together and celebrate just being us."
You have all these instances where just being you is either the butt of a joke or it's diminished and not worthy of a specific title in these larger institutions. So what does it mean to just to be loved up on and celebrated?
It felt like a self-care project at first. You know, for the first couple of years, folks were coming and they were getting that sisterhood. They were getting that tribe work that they were missing in their everyday lives.
I love the Black Girl Magic Ball because we got us. If I go out with a bang, they'll remember that Mahogany worked her a** off to make sure all the Black girls everywhere knew that she was the light. We are the blueprint.
For more information on Mahogany L. Browne, her work, and her future projects, visit her website or follow her on IG @mobrowne.
Featured image by Anthony Artis
Listen, based on what I know (because I have learned to not talk about celebrities like I know them, unless I actually do), I have a lot of respect for the filmmaking phenomenon Ryan Coogler. In fact, a close friend of mine and I were recently talking about how much we enjoyed an NPR interview that he did late last month (“Ryan Coogler Paid A Steep Price For The Films He Made”).
And although I’ve heard the his movie Sinners is “that one” right now (did you know that it has crossed the $300 million mark at the time of this being published?), because I am a bit squeamish when it comes to violence and gore, I am still on the fence about personally checking it out; especially after Michael B. Jordan said himself that all of the (fake) blood even caused him to need to take breaks throughout filming. I dunno…maybe in the daytime. We’ll see. LOL.
Anyway, all of the talk about vampires — you know, due to the film — did cause me to wonder something that might seem rather random, yet that’s oftentimes how my mind works: Do vampires give each other hickeys? As I Googled for an answer, besides a book that has a title close to that name, I did notice an ABC feature from when the vampire Twilight film series was all the rage several years back. It was inquiring if teens were suddenly biting each other (back then) because of the movie(s).
The sexologist who was interviewed came to the conclusion that since biting is “an extension of the hickey” and hickeys are (typically) considered to be passionate, that’s why teens were interested in doing it. As far as what vampires do with each other? I couldn’t find a definitive answer.
I dunno. With hickeys also being called “love bites” and “suck marks” and with folks oftentimes describing vampire-themed movies as sexy, I would think that they could. Either way, what we know for sure is that those of us in the real world do it — and so, in honor/acknowledgement of that, I figured that now would be a perfect time to share some facts about hickeys. Ready?
1. Humans Are Copying Animals When They Give Hickeys
Aight, so what exactly is the origin story of hickeys? It would seem that it came from the literature of authors who wrote about what animals like lions and wolves do whenever they are showing affection towards one another. Apparently, humans saw this and eventually began to follow suit.
Hey, that doesn’t sound so crazy to me, considering doggy style continues to be a fan favorite among our species, and…have you ever seen two cats have sex before? I have, more than once, and the male cat is typically biting on the female one, in her neck region, during the act. So, when I really stop to think about all of this, it definitely tracks.
2. Hickeys Are Oftentimes a Low-Key Power Play
Ah, perfect. If you click here, you will actually see a picture of two cats having sex, and — like I just said, the male cat is biting the female cat. One reason why is because male cat penises have barbs on them which can make the entry or exit of intercourse literally painful for the female. And so, the male cat holds her in place by biting her, so that she doesn’t run away. And yes, along these same lines, some believe that hickeys can serve as their own power dynamic shift, even among humans — especially based on where a person decides to put one. I guess it would be like “peeing on your territory” in a way — hmph, which is something else that animals tend to do.
3. Hickeys Are Nothing More than a Bruise
Okay, so what actually causes a hickey to happen? Well, when someone sucks and gently bites on your skin, it can break some of the surface blood vessels that are underneath your skin to break. When that happens, it results in a bruise. If someone does this to you for about a half a minute, you should notice a hickey emerge in a matter of minutes and, depending on how “good” of a job they did, a hickey can stick around for as much as a couple of weeks.
4. “Temperature Play” Speeds Up the Healing Process of Hickeys
Again, depending on how “good” of a job someone did at giving you a hickey, it could last between two days and two weeks. If you want yours to fade faster, because, again, hickeys are a bruise, it’s a good idea to bring some temperature play into action. What I mean by that is, start off by putting an ice pack on your hickey for up to 10 minutes, twice a day, for the first two days.
Then, after 48 hours, apply a warm compress for 10 minutes a few times a day. You might also want to apply a bit of peppermint oil to your hickey and gently massage that area as well; that will help to bring more blood flow to the spot, so that your skin can heal faster.
5. If You Take Blood Thinners, Hickeys Will Last Longer
If you’re someone who takes blood thinners, that will keep hickeys aren’t for a longer period of time. That’s because blood thinners are specifically designed to slow down the blood clotting process that’s in your body. So, if you’re big on hickeys and you even take aspirin on a fairly regular basis, you’re gonna have to accept that the “hickey healing hacks” may not actually work for you (at least not as quickly or effectively).
6. Certain “Natural Things” Can Make Them Last Longer Too
Speaking of blood thinners, even if you aren’t on any meds, did you know that certain foods provide blood-thinning effects as well? Some of those include ginger, garlic, aloe, turmeric, and cayenne pepper, and even supplements including vitamin E and melatonin. Just something to keep in mind. (By the way, vitamin C and the bromelain in pineapples can help to heal hickeys as far as supplements and foods go).
7. No, Hickeys Will Not Give You Cancer
It actually wasn’t until I was doing research for this article that I even heard the myth that hickeys can give you cancer. What in the world? Yeah, if you heard that somewhere before, pay that tale no mind, because science absolutely says otherwise. For the most part, hickeys are relatively harmless.
8. They Can Give You an Infection, Though
And why did I just say, “for the most part”? Yeah, you caught that, huh? Well, there is an extreme instance where a woman had a stroke due to a hickey because it happened on top of a major artery — that’s hella rare, though. What is more common is oral herpes transmitted through hickeys.
Not to mention the fact that a hickey is usually a bruise more than a wound; however, if your skin does end up being broken or you’re giving a hickey and blood is somehow transmitted…well, I’m sure you could see how this could be potentially problematic. Bottom line, get — and stay getting — tested. Just to be on the safe side. Hickeys or not.
9. A Dream About Getting a Hickey Is Actually a Warning
Remember how I said earlier that sometimes the person who is giving the hickey is doing so as an act of power? Well, along those same lines, if you happen to dream that someone is giving you a love bite, keep in mind that it probably isn’t about anything sexual; usually, it means that you are either in a toxic or stressful situation and you’re trying to figure out if you should approach it with logic or emotion. The more you know.
10. Sometimes Pain Creates Pleasure
Someone who enjoys being tortured or humiliated during sex, they fall into a category that is known as sexual masochism — and no, that is not what I am referring to here. What I am speaking about is the fact that, because pain and pleasure sensations are housed in the same part of the brain, when mild pain is felt, that could be why it arouses you — and that could be why you may enjoy receiving hickeys (I mean, if you actually do). They both have been proven to create a dopamine and opioid surge, which can intensify your sexual responses and reactions.
____
Hickeys do tend to create a very polarizing response: folks either adore them or loathe them. Either way, now you know what they’re all about, so if you’re on the “A” team, share it with those who are also in your club.
It could make them appreciate hickeys — love bites, suck marks — that much more, chile.
Dig in. #wink
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Featured image by Giphy